Do you use police specials?

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Do you use police specials?

Post  bareknuckleroo on Sun Aug 11, 2013 4:12 pm

I'm wondering how many people here have police specials turned on? I used to think they were an interesting alternative to dealing with enemies... but then I remember why they were in SoR1, and why they're so much less fun than Offensive/Defensive Specials are.

SoR1 has a super basic combat system (literally optimal fighting consists of jabbing the same enemy over and over) and some bosses/scenes can get a bit silly in hard mode. Instead of polishing the game up or giving your characters some extra moves to their moveset, they get usable 'bombs' that essentially wipe a lifebar off everything onscreen. The problem is that they don't feel like there's skill involved, and more like it's a means of bypassing a section that feels way to cheap to deal with normally.

At first I thought they were comparable with bombs in shmups... but good shmups tend not to have lifebars and rather use small hitboxes with a death on a hit. Bombs are never necessary in a good shmup because the patterns can always be dealt with via pure dodging, but if you're about to get hit, you can avoid taking damage by using a bomb. In really good shmups like Espgaluda, your bombs can be used offensively as well for speedkilling a midboss in order to get extra enemies to appear, thus earning more points, so they can be used more strategically than simply being a screen wipe.

In this way, I feel SoR2 and 3's addition of Offensive and Defensive Specials that both pull from the same resource pool (either health or a recharging meter) are more fun. You have a means of dodging attacks and damaging strong enemies, with the skill of having to manage when to use it offensively or save it for avoiding damage.

Personally, I leave Police Specials off in the Remake. Like in SoR1, you can't always rely on having them in a scene, and if your idea of game balance is to make your mod around the assumption the player will save their police special for that section, that's bad game design. When you've got a limited resource you can use anywhere in the stage and there's only one 'right' spot to use it, that's not fun. When you've got enemy waves full of ninjas and kickboxers that are ludicrously hard, the game ought to be balanced around making it difficult, but still possible to manage with your moveset, instead of "oh well this wave is too hard, keep dying and using Police Specials until it's over". Leaving Police Specials off helps me find ways of dealing with those really difficult sections so that in areas where Police Specials aren't available, you'll be good enough to handle them without needing them. They do just over half a lifebar of damage... not much when you consider some of the difficult waves have enemies with multiple lifebars, so relying on it instead of having a good strategy will likely cost you lives.

Elle I think is a good example of why Police Specials are bad for game balance - I almost feel like her moveset was designed with her 'use anywhere' Police Special in mind, but her moveset feels a bit too slow and is lacking in strength overall, even with her Police Specials! Her Police Special will, at best, clear only one wave of enemies and when the next comes along, you're stuck with what she's got.

Ultimately I think they're a gimmicky attack that doesn't fit in a precision beat 'em up where your Offensive and Defensive Specials already give you that extra edge, especially when they're turned off arbitrarily when you're indoors (unless you're playing certain characters. I'm curious how many people leave Police Specials on and actively use them or if they turn them off too?
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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  BigDarsh on Sun Aug 11, 2013 7:28 pm

Nice statement and I agree with you for the most part.
-bomb system < advanced moveset, gameplay wise
-relying on advanced technique to clear a battle sharpen your skill and improve your knowledge of the overall system (AI pattern, attack property etc)

However, I still activate police. I don't use them that much to tell the truth. I always try to find a way to beat a stage without it before using it. So in most stages, I just don't use police, but for specific battle of some mod, I'm just stuck. I don't find anyway to clear some battle without using police.

So as you state in your first post, I use police to overcome my skill limitation, but don't use it everytime I could since it do not help me to get better.

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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Shadow Fist King on Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:02 pm

I only use them when I feel I absolutely have to, like against bosses or if I'm in a very crowded area. Sometimes they're very handy, such as those characters who can use "police" specials anywhere and anytime (Elle, Ash, Rudra).

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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Saven on Mon Aug 12, 2013 3:20 am

Either when I fight a boss, or if I am close to death and there are no health items around.

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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Don Vecta on Mon Aug 12, 2013 7:59 pm

I have it on, but I guess as my ability has improved, I use them less. Only in very hairy moments I use them as a last ditch or when I'm heavily outnumbered and shit it's about to hit the fan.

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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Crash Dummie on Wed Aug 14, 2013 3:55 pm

I leave it turned on.

Not only do I like having the option to use it, but it's an awesome looking attack.

However, I challenge myself to never use it unless I'm dying. And I'm usually successful, as I normally only start losing lives against Mr. X, and I can't use it as a last ditch attack there.

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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  WillyTheSquid on Wed Aug 14, 2013 5:34 pm

BigDarsh wrote:Nice statement and I agree with you for the most part.
-bomb system < advanced moveset, gameplay wise
-relying on advanced technique to clear a battle sharpen your skill and improve your knowledge of the overall system (AI pattern, attack property etc)

However, I still activate police. I don't use them that much to tell the truth. I always try to find a way to beat a stage without it before using it. So in most stages, I just don't use police, but for specific battle of some mod, I'm just stuck. I don't find anyway to clear some battle without using police.

So as you state in your first post, I use police to overcome my skill limitation, but don't use it everytime I could since it do not help me to get better.
This. Smile

Don Vecta wrote:I have it on, but I guess as my ability has improved, I use them less. Only in very hairy moments I use them as a last ditch or when I'm heavily outnumbered and shit it's about to hit the fan.
And this. Smile

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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  RollingSkull on Fri Oct 11, 2013 6:18 am

I can't even reliably beat the game on Hard with all the continues allotted so generally I try to use police specials.

I think they make a nice addition to the game so long as the game isn't balanced around using them. Giving the player extraneous abilities they don't always need but offer a cushion is usually a fine bit of game design. Plus, the act of using them doesn't feel particularly noble. If a player thinks "I'll just call the cops to get through this," rather than "Welp, I don't think I can hack this without the cops..." that's the player's problem.

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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  DarkThief on Fri Oct 11, 2013 1:23 pm

I see it as part of the tactics, either as an emergency measure or pre-planned use on particularly nasty sections. Plus the 6 unlockable characters seem to be balanced around it. (X and Shiva notably given they don't have any at all, although tbh it would've been better for balance if Roo had magic and Rudra had nothing)
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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Digital S on Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:34 pm

I leave them on, but almost never ever use them since I like the extra points you get from it when clearing a stage. Kinda pointless to turn it off, just don't press the button and it's all good.

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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  bareknuckleroo on Fri Nov 29, 2013 3:43 pm

I broke down - I've turned Police Specials back on. It IS nice to have a fallback bomb after all, and the Remake on Mania is fundamentally a different game from SoR1/2/3... I also remember getting annoyed with Police Specials in stages where they glitch out, especially when an AI partner decides to use one or I forget not to use one there, and the latest update to the game fixed that, so that's no longer an issue. The leaving them on for the extra points thing is true too - star blitzes are really important, and having that extra bonus for having a police special stocked up is nice.

It still feels a bit dirty to clear sections by dying and spamming police repeatedly, but I think that's more an issue with sections where it's clearly ridiculous with the enemy AI/placement, and having a 'bomb' to make those rare spots less troublesome is nice.
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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Magnus Blade on Sat Nov 30, 2013 4:08 am

Yeah, I leave them on myself. I don't exactly use them that much (sometimes never), but I always like to think of my police/special attack as a trump card when things get dicey to the point where I need to pull a quick one to get back on my toes and think of a new approach (such as on my last life on my last continue). If I happen to have a pixel of health left and the screen is still full of enemies with multiple health bars (SoR2 route, Stage 7 with the elevator as a perfect example) and just need to drop all their health down a bit or wipe out a few peons that I remember have only a few hits to go before dying, I'd use it to just to save a life.

Nowadays since I've vastly improved my skills, I find myself using them less and less since I heavily resort to them when I'm near-receiving a game over (this only happens now when I'm like, at the VERY end of a run, which is okay, but I still want to get better with endgame without specials). However, anything that's not Mania mode, I don't ever use it in such situations. It's thanks to playing on Mania a lot that even abusing the police special doesn't help you much in the long run, as Roo pointed out, it only takes about half a full bar and bosses with 5+ bars would laugh that off.

But it's fun to have on at least. Sometimes I use it just to see it due to the awesomeness (Rudra's in particular). I can't seem to go through a run without using it at least once. XD
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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Don Vecta on Sat Nov 30, 2013 4:32 am

There's places where you just drop the F- bomb automatically since you just don't wanna bother:say, the first batches of kickboxers in the Wave 101 beach.As soon those 4 fucks appear in Mania, I blast 'em off. I know they laugh at it since they're usually a 104 x1 hp, but makes them less annoying.

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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Magnus Blade on Sat Nov 30, 2013 4:46 am

Don Vecta wrote:There's places where you just drop the F- bomb automatically since you just don't wanna bother:say, the first batches of kickboxers in the Wave 101 beach.As soon those 4 fucks appear in Mania, I blast 'em off. I know they laugh at it since they're usually a 104 x1 hp, but makes them less annoying.
I think this is about one of the only special cases where I'm carefree with it. XD Kickboxers on here are three times more of a pain than they were in SoR2. I used to like them back then, but now I really hate seeing these guys in mobs of 3+. But special attack or not, I always lose a crapton of HP, if not lose a life automatically when they appear. SoR2 Stage 7 of the remake is like my nightmare when they appear on the elevator. x.x
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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Don Vecta on Sat Nov 30, 2013 11:48 am

Magnus Blade wrote:
I think this is about one of the only special cases where I'm carefree with it. XD Kickboxers on here are three times more of a pain than they were in SoR2. I used to like them back then, but now I really hate seeing these guys in mobs of 3+. But special attack or not, I always lose a crapton of HP, if not lose a life automatically when they appear. SoR2 Stage 7 of the remake is like my nightmare when they appear on the elevator. x.x
The track Expander is the only thing that made that stage awesome... or bearable. The amount of tough enemies there is ridiculous, and in Mania is a real pain!

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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Solinarius on Sat Nov 30, 2013 5:15 pm

I personally don't like to use the police specials, aside from Elle's and Rudra's. Those, I feel, are better saved until there's only a sliver of life left, when they're most valuable. I don't give up that sliver easily, I'm a Survival Ironman Smile.

As others mentioned there are parts I don't like dealing with. For the kickboxers on the beach, I try to do as much damage as I can, Only if I know they're going to KO me, will I use the police.
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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Magnus Blade on Sun Dec 01, 2013 4:00 pm

Don Vecta wrote:The track Expander is the only thing that made that stage awesome... or bearable. The amount of tough enemies there is ridiculous, and in Mania is a real pain!
Yes! I love the theme so much. It at least helps you push on through, for the three Jets there being even more of a pain didn't make it any better. I don't even have to mention the boss battle... -.-
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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  KFCutman on Tue Mar 25, 2014 10:06 pm

I keep mine one, mainly because of the whole point. You gun down your enemies to death, nuke them with a rawket lawncher, or rain bullets on them. It helps on hard stages, notably the Barbon fight.

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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  serp on Mon Apr 21, 2014 9:05 am

I use them when I want to. I mean we've all beaten the game so many times by now I'm sure, it's not like we need it to clear a stage or anything.

I usually use it when there are a lot of enemies, especially the female enemies that crouch down and you can not hit them, because the police special will beat them even on the ground. It saves time that way. Also sometimes on the jugglers.

I don't really like using them on bosses. They're more an SOR1 path usage as the gameplay has more stuns on that and more evasive enemies at times.
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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Xillatem on Mon May 12, 2014 5:17 am

I tend to use them on Jet bosses, and when I'm down to a pixel or two of energy.
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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  ZM5 on Mon May 12, 2014 8:07 pm

I personally have them on, although I only ever use them during really difficult segments like the Expander elevator. Rest of the time I forget they even exist and only remember to use them... during scenes where they're disabled  Embarassed .
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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  El Gambito on Mon May 12, 2014 8:36 pm

I have them on always and I save em for bosses or when Im low on health I use them although sometimes I wait too much and I die before I use them xD

But I definetely save em for Jets and the kickboxers, hate those bastards!

Hmm... one of these days I'll play it without the cops.

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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Axelfan on Wed May 14, 2014 11:56 am

No. I'm an Axel 3 player.

I've got him down to a science now.

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Not usually

Post  Masta Killa on Sun Sep 07, 2014 3:56 pm

I don't usually use the police. I used to t leave it off but the Remake path would glitch and not let me continue on (Anyone know if this has been fixed? I haven't downloaded the newest ver.)

I like to try to play without using it and the extra points for not using it is nice. I feel like there are some spots where you need it though, notably any parts with Jet and his other flying friends. Especially SOR 3 Jet.
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Re: Do you use police specials?

Post  Charco on Sun Sep 07, 2014 6:58 pm

Yes that has been fixed and why are you playing the first version? There are over 100 fixes and improvements in v5.0a!!

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